On Today’s Episode of The Live Well With Josie Podcast I had the pleasure of talking to Sam Ingersoll, the marketing manager for Kalona Supernatural. Kalona is one of my favorite dairy companies who truly withholds high standards for the integrity and quality of their products while also supporting small local farms.
Sam joined me on this episode to discuss all things, regenerative farming in which he is very knowledgeable. There are so many subtopics surrounding regenerative farming that you will learn about in todays episode; the treatment of animals in conventional, organic, and regenerative farming techniques, supporting small local farmers, reaching out to your farmers, advocating for what you believe in, and why quality animal products is important for our overall health.
In today’s episode you will hear references to;
The Savory Institue
& Kalona Supernatural Request Form
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I appreciate you listening!
Hi friend. I am so excited that you were joining us for episode three of The Live Well With Josie Podcast. I really hope that you are getting extremely excited for the holidays. I know I am. I will be heading back to Ohio to visit some family members. And have Christmas with them there. Unfortunately, my husband’s in the Navy, so we will not be spending the holidays together as he has to work, but. That’s the price. We have to pay as a military family. Um, if you are a military family, please let me know, because I would love to get in contact with you. And you know how important it is to have that community within this space as well. Any, who I am extremely excited to introduce today’s guest to you. His name is Sam Ingersoll and he is the marketing manager of one of my favorite dairy companies. Kalona, supernaturals. Sam joined me on this episode to discuss all things, regenerative farming in which he is very knowledgeable. We also discussed the importance of supporting local small farmers. And why regenerative farming is so important and how it actually is a technique that has been. Utilized for many, many, many years. As you enter this conversation, please have an open mind and know that no matter what I support you and whatever you do to provide for yourself and your family as well. Coming from a very small town in Ohio. I support local farms and local families and small businesses as much as possible. And I think that no matter what, we’re all just doing the best we can, but today’s information is such an eye-opener and really gives me hope for regenerating our earth in the way that God intended it to be. So without further ado please enjoy today’s episode
Hi, Sam. Thank you so much. Hi, for joining us today, Thank you. We are so excited to have you here talking all things Kalona, supernatural dairy, regenerative farming, and just learning and growing together. this is what our podcast is all about. It’s just learning more information or even if we think we know what we’re talking about, the topic that we’re discussing, we always want to be able to learn and grow in every way possible. So we’re so excited to have you.
Thank you. I’ve been going through your Instagram feed and I’m, I’m learning a lot.
awesome. Sam, tell us who you are, what you do, and your role with Kolona Supernatural.
Conventional Farming vs. Regenerative Farming
Sure. So Kalona Supernatural is an organic dairy company. we are based out of eastern Iowa, near the small town of Kalona, population 2000. Our products go all over the country. Even as far as Hawaii, we have milk, buttermilk, sour cream, whipping cream, eggnog, yay. lots of different things. and we’re sort of known for being, minimally processed small family farms, but then being minimally processed, and we can talk about that in a minute. I’m the marketing director officially, but I spend time on farms. I get to learn a lot of things. I get to talk to a lot of people. you know, when the kids tell me I have to do something silly, I’ll go on a. Pour milk on my head, you know, whatever, whatever I gotta do, you know, I love, this is serious stuff, right? health, nutrition, the environmental consequences of farming. This is really serious stuff. But, you know, a way to hook people is to, is to get ’em entertained first. And so I, I try to do a little bit of that.
That’s amazing. I love that you’re actually out in the field because there’s so many people that, you know, we hear being marketers and that’s just their role, right? Their job is to just market for whatever company they’re working for, but the fact that you’re actually out there doing everything, you’re learning, you’re growing, and you’re out there, actually immersing yourself in the field is so amazing because you get to see every single day the growth that. Giving our world and kind of going back going back to what things were like 80 years ago, right? Yeah. But, and it’s kind of sad and we’ll talk about that here in a second too. But it’s, it’s just crazy that we’ve gotten so far away from everything. And what you guys are doing is trying to like, keep it how it’s supposed to be. One of the biggest topics I wanna talk about with you today is what is regenerative farming? We can kind of tie this into Kalona and what beyond organic means. Sure. And the regenerative farming process and why we should focus on that practice of farming.
That’s great. And I’m so glad you’re, you’re asking that question. You know, I see a lot of discussion about health, nutrition, gut health, microbes. You know, the truth is that you, if you, if you care about gut health, you have to care about soil health. And if you care about soil health, you have to care about regenerative farming because that’s what can rebuild, what has been destroyed. Absolutely. So let’s say, there are sort of three types of farming, conventional, and I’ll say organic and then regenerative. Conventional is of course, what’s been used around the world. it’s heavily mechanical. It’s monoculture corn, soybeans, right? Mm-hmm. one plant planted across the, the, the ground. and, and heavily. and, and there’s a heavy, heavy use of chemicals. there’s also, of course, destroying the natural environment to create farmland in the first place. So what’s happened around the world, especially over the last 50 years as sort of industrial agriculture dominated the United States and then was spread to other countries all over the world by American corporations, they’ve destroyed entire ecosystems, right? Tons of the, of the Brazilian rainforest has been slashed and burned in order to create farmland. Mm-hmm. and when you, when you, when you do that, you end up destroying the soil, which destroys the food and the quality of the food, which destroys people’s health and then destroys communities. Mm-hmm. There are, millions of people around the world who used to grow their own healthy food and now don’t and can’t. Mm-hmm. Also then that just means at home, for example, our land and farms are not as resilient to extreme weather events. So we could talk about, we can talk about climate change and carbon sequestration and all the reasons, and all the things about that, but it’s pretty obvious. There’s a lot of droughts, a lot of droughts going on. Iowa in the next 20 years has been getting hotter and hotter. And, for example, if the temperature’s over 90 degrees, soil, Ability of soil to, grow plants decreases. So, and this has enormous consequences for farmers, just in terms of crops, but then also in terms of, animal, animal production, right? When cows are really hot, they don’t produce as much as much milk. and there’s, you know, fertility issues, there’s all kinds of problems related to, to weather and climate. the second thing though is that, you know, back in the sixties people got got, You know, a little concerned about that. And so the organic movement started even, even before, let’s go way back, right. Indigenous Americans were not polluting the ground with chemicals and fertilizers and, and tilling it with, you know, big tractors. Right, right, right. So, so it wasn’t new. It was like we’re doing now, sort of returning to some old ways where organic, the organic movement boomed, then the government came in and put standards down. Yep. And organic is basically no herbicides, pesticides, or GMOs three years prior to harvest. Mm-hmm. right. so you can have, you can have torn, you could have torn up your soil and killed it and everything in it, and then transitioned to organic.
that’s, that’s extremely important for our listeners to understand is that just because it’s organic now, like you said, it’s, it was just three years prior is what the organic label means, so there can be so much stripped out. That’s why we don’t have as many nutritious vegetables and, and fruits and all that because we are not getting what we used to from the soil.
Exactly. Mm-hmm. you’re so smart. Even if you’re not poisoning the food with herbicides, pesticides, it doesn’t necessarily mean it’s being grown in mineral rich soil. Mm-hmm. And it doesn’t mean it has the same kind of quality that it did 50 years. so, you know, the other organic standard is sort of humane treatment of animals. Mm-hmm. like for example, our cows have to be on past minimum of 120 days a year, six months. We exceed that. Mm-hmm. usually it depends on, you know, really depends on the weather. Mm-hmm. so you got conventional you have organic, at least you’re not poisoning the environment and animals and yourself, but you’re not rebuilding, you know, you’re not creating something better. You’re not restoring what was lost and what was very good and developed over tens of thousands of years. Right. So that’s what the regenerative movement is really about. Mm-hmm. when it’s not being greenwashed, you know?
Right. And there’s, there’s a lot of that too.
Organic Farming and Regenerative Farming; Biodiversity of Soil and Carbon Sequestration.
You got it. There’s always ways around, you know, organic certification or anything anybody’s ever doing, right. Mm-hmm. or, labeling or whatever. There’s always people cutting corners. but in general, The regenerative movement is the key to restoring not only sort of, planet and food systems, but also communities. Mm-hmm. and it really focuses, I guess first in the environmental aspect focuses on four things. So soil health, right, mineral rich soil with high levels of organic manner. The second would be biodiversity. A lot of different fungi. Microbes in the soil, plants, animals, and insects, which are really important. Conventional farming kills all that stuff, right? Organic farming doesn’t kill it, but doesn’t bring it back necessarily. Right? And you can still have a, an organic farm that’s losing top soil, that isn’t biodiverse, that isn’t building soil, that isn’t retaining water to help it withstand drought and other climate disasters. And then the fourth thing is air health. I call it air health, right? But it’s carbon sequestration, right? Mm-hmm. if you look at every spring in farming, when people start tilling, you see this massive release of carbon into the air. Carbon is good by the way, right? We like carbon. Carbon is the basis of life. It’s what plants pull out of the, out of the atmosphere and exchange in the soil for the things they need. It’s really important. Right now we dumped a. A bunch of it through technology into the atmosphere. Right. But the key is not, you know, some, atmospheric scrubbers installed. Mm-hmm. The key is restoring the health of the soil and plant life to bring it down into the soil and keep it there, which it did for tens of thousands of years. When by the way, millions and millions more animals, roam the earth. right. You know, cows are the problem. Cows aren’t really the problem. How they’re managed is sort of a problem. Right. And in fact, cows and other big ruminants and, other grazing animals are the key to soil health. If I left, if you left you with sort of like one thing, you know, one thing here is that our food is less nutrient dense because the soil has been ruined, and you cannot restore the health of the soil and the health of the land without grazing animals. Absolutely. The people who think they’re too, well, okay, you could kill all the people and the earth would heal itself and the elk in the buffalo and deer and everything would come back. Right. But we don’t really want that. There’s way too much
suffering associated with that.
You can’t just grow almonds in the, in the desert and think that’s gonna gonna save the, you know, save the planet or, or, or just vegetables. and think that that’s gonna save the planet if we all convert to vegetable based diets because, hey, there’s a lot of, there’s a lot of benefit associated with nutrient dense, nutrient dense meat, dairy, et cetera. But, those animals are the key to restoring the soil health, which is the only way to really get good nutritious vegetables. Right. Absolutely. It’s all a, it’s all a circle and it’s a circle that existed for tens of thousands of years before we came with tractors and chemicals and destroyed it. And now in our arrogance, think we’re gonna, we’re gonna technology our way out of it. Like I’m, I’m Star, I’m a Star Wars, star Trek fan. Like, it’d be great if you could just create food outta molecules. but it’s Exactly, that’s not happening. That’s not going to be the answer.
Exactly. I’m from a generation of the, a show called Phil of the Future, and they would just, like, they had this spray bottle where they would spray and like a meatloaf would come out as a kid, I was like, whoa, that’s awesome. And I, it’s so crazy. I think about that so often now. Yeah. And with all of this technology coming out and all of this plant-based meat and all of this stuff, and I’m just like, oh my gosh, that is just, it’s terrible. There’s, there’s no nutrients and it’s all filled with. inflammatory oils and just synthetic fillers and it’s like we just need to be eating the real thing and a good, a good quality of the real thing, because that’s going to provide our bodies with the bioavailable nutrients that it needs. the earth was made how it was supposed to be made, and now we’re just trying to redo it with technology and it’s just, it’s so bizarre.
It’s really sad too, if you’ve been to other countries, which used to, you know, small, small towns flourished people, people grew their own food and then, you know, through American foreign policy, we opened up in Central America, south America, you know, we came. Because of our, our big corporate interests, right. Wanting to grow lots of bananas or whatever. Right. and just put these guys out of business and, you know, it was okay maybe for, for some of us who aren’t paying attention and don’t, you know, aren’t concerned what’s going on in the parts world. But it’s happened here now. Right. American farmland is being bought up by big multi-country conglomerates. China has bought tons of the pork processing facilities here. Right. You know, people stress about B G buying up land. We don’t know what he’s doing with it. Yeah. we do know that what he’s doing in India is devastating small farmers. so you have this collusion of like big, big corporate. You know, interests and then big do-gooder interests that are not really doing, good for people in the world. And it’s, it’s pretty sad when you really, when you see it, really, you know, 20 years ago we had, and it’s, it’s just progressing, right? We had a huge in, out, huge shutdown of farms, dairy farmers going out of business. people were committing suicide. It’s still really happening. You know, you should go down a road in Iowa and there would be 10 small farms. Now there’s like one because because of big agriculture. And by the way, farms in Iowa are not producing food for the rest of the world. They’re not 40% goes to ethanol production. Wow. What we need, what we need is to get back to small foods, small farms, local food distribution, and then those farms, rebuilding the ecosystem.
Absolutely. So can you tell us if I’m driving down a road, Yep. And I am driving through Iowa, or I’m from Ohio. Yeah. Very small town, farmland, Ohio. But if I’m driving down the road, what would be the difference of what I would see from a conventional farm and a regenerative.
Yep. So the first thing is in the spring, if you see tilling mm-hmm. if you see tilling, and you’ll never look at farms again. the, the tilling is doing a couple things, right? Mm-hmm. a just digging it up, it’s releasing clouds and clouds of, of carbon that’s been stored there for years. Mm-hmm. the second thing is, it’s like, it’s taking these, like in one teaspoon of soil, there’s like 9 billion microbes mm-hmm. and we understand like what a small fraction do, right? It’s just kinda like gut health. We understand some things, but there’s a lot of in interconnected parts and things that we don’t understand. Mm-hmm. So when you till the soil, it’s like taking like a city and shoving it up against the sun, right? Mm-hmm. cooks it. Everything burst into flames, things die. Right? Yeah. Right. That’s first thing. second. So you, if you see in the spring where there, where there are crops, but they’re not tilling, what they’re doing is, they’re using no-till practices. So that’s really important. Okay. Second thing, plant diversity. Right? Wherever you see one or two crops sort of rotated mm-hmm. that is an indicator that they’re not providing the, the amount of plant diversity that is needed by the soil to regrow. So, for example, different plants do different things. Some have really deep tap roots. Mm-hmm. that bring up moisture and minerals from way down low. Some have roots that expand and then decompose, which creates space for water. So they do different things. what you wanna look for is cover crop. the more plants you have, just think this, the more plants you have, you walk into any field, if you see like two or three plants kind of species, and then space in between the plants where the, where there’s just like baked dirt mm-hmm. that’s bad. Right? The more crops you have, the more plants you have of all shapes and sizes, the more they’re pulling, sunlight out of sun, solar energy, out of the atmosphere. And the more they’re pulling carbon outta the atmosphere And then the more they’re doing other things. So look for, look for fields that have a diversity of crops. A lot of times they’ll look messy, right? We have this beautiful picture of rolling corn and beans, right? Like right. this, the final thing, and this is the thing a lot of people key on with regenerative and grass fed dairy and grassfed beef is livestock integration. Mm-hmm. So it’s just like plant diversity, right? Different animals and bugs do different things for the soil. if you drive and you see a, cows sort of wandering around big area, Of a pasture, you can almost be sure that they’re overgrazing it. If it looks like a golf course, you can be sure they’re overgrazing it. They’re killing one or two different types of species that they prefer, prefer. Mm-hmm. they’re allowed to graze all the way down to the soil practically, which means the, the roots don’t have a chance to grow. So they’re just going around killing, killing, killing the plant and stopping it from growing. And because of they’re going around like that, they’re stopping diversity from happening. If you look at a pasture and you see cows bunched into one area mm-hmm. and then the next day you see them move to another area, and then another area, then you know that, the farmer is wisely giving most of his pasture throughout the month or year, the chance to recover. So if you don’t bring cows back onto a particular plot of ground mm-hmm. that gives the plants a chance to fully regrow up here. And it gives the chance, plants of a chance to. put down deep root systems mm-hmm. and it allows other plants to grow. Right. This is what happened in over 10, tens of thousands of years when we had 60 million buffalo running around. I mean, you look at pictures, they were like, like just millions would swarm over the hills. And so, you know, were they belching and farting too much carbon into the atmosphere? No Right, right, right, right. They were packed together by the predators that were natural too. Mm-hmm. And then they would cluster, they’d stomp on the ground, they’d fertilize the ground, they’d break up the dry soil, and they would eat everything, and then they would move on and wouldn’t come back for another year giving the chan, giving the soil a full chance to recover. Now imagine if you just kinda like let them all stay there all year long. Deserts is what happens, right? The soil gets depleted, it doesn’t regenerate, and then you get deserts. I mean, there’s something like 60 million, there’s grasslands across the, the world and two thirds are degraded and more and more turning into deserts all the time because we’re not grazing animals correctly, and we’re using sort of conventional farming techniques on them.
Right. Thank you so much. That was such a good explanation. That’s something like, as much as I feel like I have done research on regenerative farming and I know too, like I’m, I’m learning so much from you, and that’s just so valuable. The fact that even though the cow is grazing on grass, it’s not necessarily, might not be the type of way that’s going to help renew the soil in the way. That’s right. It needs to be renewed, which is Yep. That’s, that’s such valuable information. okay, so for dairy, Let’s go into Kolona and what beyond organic means, and because obviously regenerative farming is great for the soil, great for the earth. So I kind of wanna tie this into actual quality of dairy that we are consuming because as a gut health nutritionist, I work with a lot of clients who might have, you know, autoimmune diseases. I personally do. And I, I was dairy free for like six years because you’re told that it’s like that’s what’s causing all these issues. Well, we know, if you’re listening to this you have probably seen things on Instagram or you’ve done some research prior, and if not, conventional dairy. Those cows are not treated well, they’re not fed well, and they’re fed a bunch of like inflammatory type of things. But, I want you to kind of go into this, Sam, about how your beyond organic at Kolona, as opposed to conventional is better for the human in general to consume as opposed to conventional.
It is important to know what your Cows are being fed!
Yep. Yep. So, anybody following along probably knows, well, they may know something about conventional dairy, right? Right. Where you get thousands of cows, you packed them into, they get packed into feed. No, we don’t do that. you, you don’t do that. Thousands of cows get packed into feed lots. They get fed a really heavy diet of GMO grain. Mm-hmm. their energy’s jacked up and then they produce tons of milk. So they produce, say, three times the amount of milk that, a grass fed cow, will mm-hmm. So that’s the first thing people ask. What a, why is it so expensive? Well, because they produce three times the amount of milk. Now, by doing that, of course it puts the cow system under a tremendous amount of stress. Cows actually can digest grain. Mm-hmm. grain is seeds. Right. And they have a biological mechanism for doing that. Mm-hmm. which was needed, is needed in the wild. Right, right. When there are no grasses or there’s a drought and there’s just seeds on the ground mm-hmm. so there is a, there is a biological mechanism for that. But when these, CAFOs, these conventional dairy farms give their cows 40. Or more or whatever of their diet, their system is really revved up. you know, like, you know, when, when women are pregnant, sometimes their diets are different, right? They need more energy or in their nursing they need more energy. Mm-hmm. So, and that’s okay. But you wouldn’t, you wouldn’t give a pregnant mom like a ton of Hershey’s bars and caffeine to jack up their system and that’s all they ate all the time. Right? Right. That would not be good. Mm-hmm. So that’s kinda what’s happening to, to the cows and conventional dairies end result. They last about two to three years on average and then are turned into fast foodJosie:
burger. Yeah. Well, and I’ve even heard how some of these cows are fed, things like Skittles and stuff like that to help their production of their milk. And it’s just with the sugar intake and all of that, and it’s just insane what we can actually be consuming. I say that all the time that having some sort of animal product is better than not. But we also just have to be aware of the quality that we’re consuming, and always vote with your dollar and make for sure that you are really doing the research and focusing on what kind of quality you’re getting. Because that’s when people say like, oh, meat or dairy is a carcinogen and it’s, you know, this and it’s that. And it’s like, okay, there’s a lot that we can unpack here, but it’s also where you’re getting the quality of your dairy and of your meat. It’s just fascinating what goes on behind the scenes that we don’t even.
Yeah. And I, you know, you said you, you know a lot of farmers. I know a lot of farmers too. Mm-hmm. So I don’t wanna, I don’t wanna pick on people, I don’t wanna pick on people here, you know, people, whether they’re farmers or people with their health, everybody’s doing the best they can. Right. You know, you have to make, everybody has to make, compromises usually it’s really hard to live, you know, a really pure diet. Right. You know, consistent with your best values and best self. Mm-hmm. like, it’s hard and I know that. and so, you know, God bless anybody who’s working on it and doing the best with what they have. Exactly. Exactly. Everybody should, everybody should feel okay about that. So, and even, you know, even in, even in, grass-fed dairies, for example, a hundred percent grass-fed, right? Mm-hmm. the cow health is still an issue. The cows still need a lot of energy to produce milk, you know, they’re, you know, lots of them get corn syrup, right? But overall, these are good dairies. They produce, you know, they’re primarily grassfed, and they treat their animals well. So, you know, I don’t wanna pick on anybody for that either too necessarily. I know. So, well, let’s go to Grassfed. Jump from conventional to sort of grassfed. Yeah, absolutely. grassfed is where, cows eat a hundred percent. Grassfed is where cows eat grass, grasses, Forbes, legumes, other things on pasture, a hundred percent or the majority of the majority of the time. Now, grassfed doesn’t necessarily mean organic. Right? Right. Organic doesn’t necessarily mean regenerative. Mm-hmm. so you’re really looking, what you really want is organic, organic grass fed. Mm-hmm. whether it’s certified or not, you’re looking for a farm that, a farm that produces that. Right. And just like I said, we, you know, there’s so much we don’t understand, but we believe, and I know a lot of our customers believe that natural is better. Mm-hmm. right. So Grassfed has mean I’m not supposed to, you know, we got the F FDA looking at us too, so Yeah. I can’t, I can’t go on about health benefits. That’s why I’m really appreciative of people like you who invite us on and do educate people on this stuff. Right. but we think it’s re much better for lots of reasons. The most common one that is defensible with the science that’s been done is increased levels of CLA’s. Mm-hmm. that’s the key thing. but I think there are lots of other measurements. if people were interested in doing the research, And spending lots of money to do the research. Right. that would show that, grass fed, naturally fed cows produce our quality meat and dairy in lots of ways. Absolutely. And, and you know, right from the, how you feel based on when you eat
it. Absolutely. Well, and, and the thing is too, with me saying that, like, I was dairy free for six years. I was so afraid of it. I would get some, I would like, personally, I would get eczema, I would have flare-ups, all these things. But once I actually started to do research on the quality of dairy and, you know, get more raw dairy from farmers near me, and then finding Kalona in a store near me, it was completely a game changer because I could, in, I reintroduced dairy and I felt totally fine. And then I also, like I had no adverse symptoms from it. I also felt. Energized. I felt like my, I was satiated. You know, there, there were times where I was just like, gosh, like some, I just need something, but I didn’t know what I need. And now I’ll just have like, you know, some cottage cheese or a glass of milk, or I make, I love, I love, I make, my homemade whipped cream with the Cologna heavy cream, and I would Yep, absolutely. Right there, it’s the best. It’s like, it’s like my baby, because I, that’s what I get every time I go. I stock up when it’s there because at my store it’s always out. So I’m like, okay, if it’s there, oh no, I’m going to get a couple of these. but I genuinely couldn’t believe that I could just like add in dairy after six years of not having it. And again, feel totally fine. And I grew up Italian. I grew up on bread. Oh boy. And cheese. Yeah. And so it’s like, when I found out, I know it was, it was insane. But being able to just like be happy and add that in. It’s amazing that the difference of what you guys provide, the quality that you provide compared to conventional dairy. Cuz when I do have conventional dairy, I notice some brain fog. I notice some, maybe I’ll have a little bit more of like a eczema rash pop up or something along that sort. yeah, you can definitely feel the difference. And, and a lot of people who don’t think that they can have dairy, just haven’t had the right dairy for them.
Processing of Dairy Products & Why it is Important for your Health.
I’d agree. I think there are four things here to think about. One is, one is the cows diet, right? If they’re getting a lot of grains, if they’re getting a lot of GMOs and you have any kind of allergies to that stuff, then conventional is bad, right? Mm-hmm. grass fed is good. much, much better. And if it’s organic, So there’s nothing else associated with it. No GMOs, no herbicides, no pesticide wash, anything like that. That’s probably even better. Mm-hmm. But then there’s another factor and that is, well two things. The first would be, A2A2 cows versus not A2. Mm-hmm. lots of discussion about this. Right. lots of people do have an allergy towards non A2 dairy. Right. 60 to 80% of our herds are A2 cows. The whole industry is moving that way. Mm-hmm. because of that issue. Right. and so that’s, that’s another reason why people, why we think people can digest our milk better than most. Absolutely. And then the fourth is the, is the way it’s processed. So think about this. You have this, you know, beautiful, beautiful little farm. the cows are eating a hundred percent grass. it’s organic, it’s wonderful. And then it goes off to the bottling plant where two things happen. First of all, they ultra high temp pasteurize it at 280 degrees Fahrenheit. Mm-hmm. sterilizing it, and secondly, they homogenize it. So the cream fat is placed under 3000 pounds of pressure and smashed into millions and millions of pieces. Wow. That’s what, when we say we’re, beyond organic, it’s because of the nature of our farms, but then also the nature of processing. Right. So you’ve taken, you know, it’s like taking, taking organic green beans, you know, or like an apple and you shove it in the microwave, you know, for 15 minutes. Right. It’s probably not gonna have the same properties that, right. it would if you just ate it raw. Right.
Yeah. So when you discuss your processing, that is mainly the beyond organic, what you guys call Kalona beyond organic, mm-hmm. You’re talking about the regenerative farming process. Well, both, right? Yep. Yep. The
source of our
food and farms. Yeah. And then you’re talking about the processing of your dairy as well.
Yep. So it, we used to say minimally processed and then I started going, well, this is like, we’re beyond organic. We’re organic. Cuz lots people look at organic, right? They want organic milk, but we’re organic plus from small family farms that use regenerative farming practices mm-hmm. and it’s minimally processed, low temp pasteurization, the lowest temperature allowed by law and non-homogenized. And then we try to avoid any kind of additives or stabilizers or anything. Right. as far as much as we can
Yeah. Yeah. That’s, that’s phenomenal. It’s such a relief when you’re able to find companies, because this is something that I talk a lot with, Clients about, and you know, they’re, they’re oftentimes in a food desert. They don’t have access to a bunch of different types of good quality foods. But that’s where I say, you have to do your best. And none of this is to scare anybody or make anybody feel like less than because they can’t have access to any of these products. But it’s just to get everybody’s wheels spinning on this is something that we really need to start focusing on and being aware of just as a society and as a world. Because if we completely get away from all of this I say this to a lot of people, the foods that we’re eating today, They just, they don’t even seem real. What is organic today is kind of what foods were about like 80 years ago. So we’re trying to eat organic, we’re trying to eat locally sourced, like foods that are not sprayed with pesticides and stuff like that. And, and you know, our grandparents were like, ah, I just ate regular food. I’m fine. I’m like, but what I’m trying to eat now is what you actually ate like back then. You know? And it’s just crazy how, how our food system it’s just upside down. It’s completely upside down from where it used to be.
And look at and look at the research on autoimmune disorders. Exactly. you know, it is, this stuff has skyrocketed since the fifties when we started, you know, pumping our, pumping our, so our soils were ruined. We had to pump ’em full of herbicides, pesticides, and, and create, you know, dump fertilized nitrogen based fertilizer on them. Which is the stupidest thing, by the way, because the atmosphere’s full of nitrogen. You just need enough plants, enough diversity plants to drop down to fertilize soil.
Sourcing your Animal Products.
right. Well, and the, and the thing is too, a bunch of research has been shown that glyphosate has been one of the contributors to leaky gut, which is one of the biggest causes of these autoimmune diseases that we’re seeing in a lot of, you know, gut dysfunction, skin issues, hormonal issues, metabolic issues. And it, a lot of it is tied back to the pesticides and herbicides and fungicides and all of that that’s sprayed on our foods nowadays, cuz it’s just wreaking havoc on the gut, which is, it’s just sad. That’s not to scare you, but it’s, just to be mindful because oftentimes people think nowadays, you know, like we’re so in this diet culture mindset where. If we work out, we’re healthy, we can eat whatever we want, but as long as we work out, we’re fine. And that’s oftentimes the individual who is seemingly healthy at this point in their life and they’re not having any issues. Well, a lot of these people who are having these autoimmune issues, these gut issues, these skin issues, hormonal issues, more metabolic issues, and they’re not understanding like where all of this is stemming from. That’s where like I work with them and I say, let’s look at the quality of foods that you’re eating. But if you’re in a food desert, like I have multiple clients who are in these food deserts, you can only do what you can do. And, and that’s not to say like, Don’t, just don’t buy anything. Don’t eat anything. Yeah. Because you want to do your best. There’s also different resources, like these different food, delivery systems mm-hmm. that can also get you better quality foods, things like that. You can order these good quality foods online, but also talking to your local farmers, because a lot of local farmers, it’s, it’s really interesting because back in Ohio, my mom was talking to somebody, at, I think it was the local farmer’s market, or sorry, it was a strawberry farm nearby. And, they were telling them that, yeah, we don’t spray anything on it. We, we consider ourselves organic and technically beyond organic with their farming system and all of that, but they just don’t have the label. So that’s one of the biggest things is. If you talk to your farmers, if you talk to your local, anybody who has like a local, small garden or anything, it’s one of the easiest ways to get better quality foods. even if it’s not perfect, at least you’re doing the best you can, but talking with your farmers, because they could be potentially doing these practices, but it is so expensive to get the label from, you know, from the eff dee ey and all that to be able to say that this is what you are. So that’s one thing that. We can do, we, we can always do our best, but it’s amazing to have products like you guys Kalona in stores where if you do have the access to that, being able to just be like, this is a company I trust and I respect and I know that they’re doing the best that they can for their consumers. Yeah, you’re a company, but you are not just trying to make money, you are trying to provide the best quality of what we are consuming to your consumer because you genuinely care about your consumers and their health and not just making a dollar on it. and that’s what I really appreciate is knowing that there are companies like you, you can walk into the door, you know exactly where it is in that, in that section. And hopefully we can get you guys in more stores too, but it’s just amazing that you can walk into a store, know that you trust that company and grab what you need.
Yeah. And I, you know, I really appreciate your work with people on their health. you know, the pollution of their food, the pollution of food will continue to happen unless consumers start to demand regenerative. Right. because if we don’t, eventually, everything just gets more processed to just keep pumping more chemicals and ruining the soil in order to keep production up. And it’s not sustainable. It’s not sustainable for not only the rest of the world, but now even impacting on places like Iowa, which have, you know, really rich topJosie: 36:15
soil. Right. So how would you tell somebody they could get involved with helping advocate for regenerative farming?
There are lots of people doing regenerative work, called regenerative work. But I would go look at the Savory Institute. the Savory Institute is probably best well known for a particular kind of grazing management. Mm-hmm. that restores the soil. And I really believe that’s the key. you know, we can’t plant enough trees in the desert and water, enough trees in the desert, to regrow the soil there. But we could, with animals, renew the soil and turn those back into grasslands. And then fertile land for both grazing and crop product. So go look at the Saver Institute’s Land to Market Program. on the nutrition side, I’m a fan of Diane Rogers too, who talks a lot about, the density of the, the nutritional benefits of of meat. I look for the Savory Institute, land of market program. We’ve had a bunch of people trained, our farmers are doing those kind of practices. and this is a little complicated, but theirs is the best system for looking at the ecosystem in a holistic way. Mm-hmm. right. In science. and sometimes in our lives we think like, okay, like if my kid’s misbehaving, you know, with a kid at school, like if I just fix that little issue, right, right. Or if I study something associated with human. in just, I isolate that variable, and then I can tell something from that. not really true, right? So many things are interconnected. Mm-hmm. it’s sort of the ar I, I graduated from Yale, you know, the arrogance of intellectual or intellectual, thinking and, and technology, is a problem. It keeps us from seeing things in relation to each other. Mm-hmm. and the Savory Institute is really good about looking at ecosystems, how they’re connected, and the impact on communities. That, that’s just really important. It’s a little complicated, but it’s really important. So I’d start there. Look for Allen Savory’s TEDx Talk. Okay. It, it, it was the one thing that inspired me, you know, looking at the world and what’s going on in the world and stuff, and my own health, et cetera. It was the one thing that really inspired me, and gave me some hope for the planet, for animals, for the environment, human health and, and, mm-hmm. and human, communities and civiliz.
The Difference of Dairy Sell By Date vs. Expiration Date.
Yeah. That’s amazing. The, the biggest, the, and the most important takeaway from that is the fact that we’re trying to regenerate the earth and regenerate the soils and really make for sure that the animals have quality life and while they also have quality, quality life that they’re giving back to the earth. And everything’s just renewing itself in the way that it needs to be. Exactly. Awesome. Okay, so one thing that I found super interesting, I found on your guys’ Instagram, and I think you were the one who was talking about it, was your your sell by date versus expiration date. And I just, I found it fascinating. So if you would, if you would talk about that a little bit.
Sure. So thank you for answering that, asking that question. Mm-hmm. confusion over cell by date and expiration date accounts for about 20% of food waste. Think of the millions of pounds of food that get thrown away. Yeah. That could be going somewhere like into us or you know, down at the food bank or wherever. Right. so the sell by date, or best by date are not related to food safety. Okay. People often think that, but they’re not related to su food safety. In fact, you almost won’t on dairy you won’t almost ever see an expiration date. You’ll typically see a sell by date or a used by date. And all that date means is that is our estimate of when food is at its peak quality. It does not mean that it shouldn’t be sold. It does not mean that you can’t consume it. It just means it’s an estimate that we’re forced to put on there by the government. Yeah. that indicates when it’s at peak quality. Wow. Right. People get confused about
that. Yeah. I would’ve had no
idea. Yep. That’s amazing. So, when you get it, there’s a difference, usually based on the level of pasteurization. So, you know, raw milk will, will spoil faster, right? Pasteurized milk will spoil slower, but there’s sort of three levels of, of pasteurization. One level people should look for is bat or vat. Vat or batch pasteurization. That’s the lowest possible temperature allowed by law. In that case. it needs to be refrigerated, and it will generally spoil a little quicker. but that means it’s frustrated. That means it hasn’t been overly processed and all the goodness sterilized out of it. The next level is H T S T. You’ll, that’s a little bit higher pasteurization. you’ll see that on for like cultured products. And then there’s ultra high-tech patch pasteurization, which I talk about all the time. Nuts never u h t, right? It’s, it’s sterilized at 280 degrees, package the antiseptic packaging and can be just stored in your pantry, you know, for weeks, months, without refrigeration. The only way you, the only reason u h t milk is refrigerated. The only real reason is because if you took those organic milks that you see those other organic milks competitors that you see mm-hmm. outta the fridge, put ’em on the shelf, nobody would buy them. Right. Cause people would rightly think that something maybe was a little wrong with them, Right. You know, and I, and I need to be nice and respectful here, but I just think it’s awful to, like, you have this perfect, amazing food and then you just kill it. Yeah. So, by the way mm-hmm. by the way, so it can travel all the way across the country, and make more money for the stockholders and shareholders. Now Gotcha. If the, I won’t name competitors, but if the stockholders and shareholders are small family farms mm-hmm. you know, that are trying to survive, I don’t wanna fault them for that. If they’re big multi multinational conglomerates, you know, that are answering the stockholders, and here’s the other thing, they do that for shelf space. Mm-hmm. because if a big, if a company there are. Some dairies are also funded by venture capitalists. And what are they interested? Are they interested in the small farms or nutritionally dense food? No. They’re interested in raising a bunch of money. Right. Spending millions of dollars on advertising to dominate store shelves. Yeah. To put the little guys, the small producers, the small farmers out of business, and then they sell out, they jack up their prices and make more money. Or then they can sell out to somebody bigger. There is another company, I won’t mention the name, that has, sour cream on the shelf. And they’re good people. They’re good guys. Mm-hmm. but they just raised 60 million in venture capital. Venture capital that is going to paying stores and advertising and paying stores to get on their shelves and dominate their shelves. Mm-hmm. And that squeezes every little guy, every local company, every small company like us. Right. Except for the fact that some people like you and people listening are passionate about what we’re doing. There’s no way we could compete without, without your guy support. Yeah. So, back to sell by, used by. So if you get, if you get our products and most dairy products can go fi at least five to seven days unopened. Mm-hmm. if you keep it in a cooler place, it’s likely to last longer. So there was a study that showed by dropping the temperature of the refrigeration from 43 degrees down to 39 degrees. Mm-hmm. lengthen that by nine days. So, and even if you store it in the back of your fridge where it’s cooler as opposed to the door, it’s likely to last. That’s fascinating. Yep. If you’ve opened milk mm-hmm. doesn’t matter whether it’s been u h t sterilized or low temp pasteurized like ours or raw. Right. It immediately, bacteria gets in, immediately starts to go bad. Right Now if you drink it out of the bottle, it’s gonna get more bacteria and go bad a lot quicker. The real answer is to smell it and taste it. And you can tell if it’s, you can tell if it’s going bad with one, with one thing about our milk, right? Mm-hmm. because it’s low temp, pasteurized and grass-fed and minimally processed. It definitely has a different kind of taste and feel to it. Mm-hmm. And some people, when they’re new to it, they’re like, this is different. Yeah. If you’re from another country where they never do pasteurization or from a farmer and raw milk, you’ll be like, wow, this reminds me of growing up. Mm-hmm. my hourly kitchen. Mm-hmm. back in India. Like, we get those kind of questions, comments all the time, really. so if you’re a first time user, it will taste a little different from. The sort of water taste of like a conventional milk, right? Or the, the sickly sweet taste of a milk that’s had all its sugars cooked. Mm-hmm. so you might experience that a little bit differently. And then because we’re not homogenized and the cream rises to the top, you’re definitely gonna see like cream. It’s almost like a butter. Mm-hmm. if it’s that a long time, at the top and you need to shake it up. the good news is that if your milk has spoiled a little bit, you can use it anywhere you use buttermilk or sour cream. Eight years ago, nobody, nobody threw
it out. Right, exactly. Exactly. And that’s something I, I use up all my dairy when I have it usually. But, that’s something I’ve been wanting to do is like, make my own sour cream it’s such a cool process knowing that it’s actually really funny because I was talking earlier about how I used the heavy whipping cream to make my own whipped cream and there was a, a colleague of mine and she made, she was making whipped cream and walked away for too long and she came back and was like, I have butter. What is happening And it was just so funny. She, she posted about it on her Instagram. I was, I had like tears in my eyes because it was so funny cuz about like a week earlier. I had said, don’t walk away. Like I was showing my community how to make whip whipped cream. And I was like, don’t walk away cuz y’all have butter And then she did that and I was like, I’m assuming you did not see my video. And she’s like, I did not see your video It was so funny. But it’s just amazing, like what you can do and you can even, I see that you guys have shared where you can just shake it up in a jar and it becomes butter that way. And it’s, it’s really cool. It’s, you can, you don’t need to waste your food. You can turn it into something else, which is pretty amazing. Doing stuff
like that also introduces kids, you know, in a, in a nice way. Like we’ve, we’ve got our chocolate milk, you know? Mm-hmm. which is unbelievable. It’s like liquid ice cream, you know, but it has way too much sugar. If there was a health thing, I would say the sugar, the sugar contents main thing, right. but it’s a way to get them into it, you know? They get, oh, cologna and they get used to that, that full mouth feel of non-homogenized and mm-hmm. and mote pasteurized milk. And then they’re like, wow, okay, I could try the other milk. And pretty soon they’re eating, you know, kids are eating organic cottage cheese or breakfast.
Go figure. Exactly. Well, and it’s, it’s amazing how when I was not eating or drinking dairy, if I, I was not consuming dairy whatsoever. And I was almost afraid of it. And because some, my family, they had some health sh health issues run in our family too. And so I would tell them like, oh, drink this, like nut milk or drink this or drink that. And it was like, now after I learned, like everything I did, I’m like, No, I’m just joking. Like everything I said, those six years is completely wrong, and especially because I was drinking canola oil while I was drinking these nut milks and stuff, and all of these synthetic, synthetic nutrients and everything that wasn’t actually helping my body out and in turn was actually contributing more to my autoimmune issues. It’s just insane that like what? It’s, there’s so much information. That’s a whole other podcast, but oh my gosh. When we are talking about, the farms that you guys utilize, the smaller farms, where are those typically found? Like if, if you are going around, is it close to Kalona? Yeah. Are all of the small farms around there?
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if you drive through Iowa and Nebraska, you know, just corn, soybean, corn, soybean, corn, soybean. Mm-hmm. Well, if you come to Kalona, which is, population 2000 outside of Iowa City as a point of reference, you know, you have corn, soybean, and then you have all this patchwork of green mm-hmm. and it’s where these Amish and Mennonite families have had farms for, it’s going back 150 years. They were organic before. There’s organic standards. Right. and I’ve been doing some regenerative stuff since, you know, people started getting excited about it, they’re ecological Oasis. Mm-hmm. you know, there’s probably a, there’s a, there’s changes a little bit, but there’s about 35 right in the right around Kalona. We’ve got a few others down in Bloomfield, Missouri, one in Illinois, a couple little bit farther north. but generally we’re one of the few, you know, areas, where there are, there are dairy farms, that are using regenerative practices and organic practices. You’ll find in Wisconsin and some of the northeast too. Mm-hmm. but, but, it’s been real hard for a lot of those to survive. Right. and if you check the news, you know, a lot of ’em are going outta business as the big companies that control them are just like, okay, we’re not gonna send a truck all the way out to your little farm anymore because you know, it costs too much. So we’re just gonna dump you and dump some other guys and just go with, go with, go with the ones closest. And by the way, the quality of milk doesn’t matter so much because we’re u h t sterilizing it.
It all, it all gets dumped in and then sterilized. So who cares? You know, if it’s super grass fed or, grown on a farm that uses regenerative farming.
Exactly. And the, I think the biggest thing too about like just being. Just being individuals who support farmers just in general is the fact that like, obviously we care about the person, we care about the farmer, we care about the family, and we know that they’re trying to make a living for themselves and their families and do what’s best and also do what they know. Like that’s what they’ve kind of grown up with and that’s what they’ve been taught. But it’s also like, it, we, we care about you as an individual and your skills and the, your skills can be put to even further use by being able to help get back to where we need to be with regenerative farming. I, I respect farmers and just anybody in that field so much. Yeah. But I also, we also know the importance of the regenerative farming practice and mm-hmm. this movement that hopefully can be pushed even more because again, Like you said, these Amish and Mennonite families who’ve been doing it for so long and Yeah, and they just never got away from it and it’s like, that’s what it used to be. That’s where we kind of need to go back to and I feel like, I feel like there’s also a movement of more homemakers and homesteaders that I’m seeing now. Very cool. I think it’s amazing because we’re really seeing the negative impact. A lot of these companies and people in general just wanna make so much money and want to like almost just take over the world. It has been having such a negative impact on our health and our wellbeings, and so many people are realizing that nowadays, and they’re wanting to come back and be able to rely on themselves and their community and not so much rely on these big companies that aren’t going to be able to help them in the times of need
What’s going on in the regenerative space. Mm-hmm. where you have multi-species grazing, all kinds of, of grazing on all kinds of land. You have pigs rooting around orchards, you know, you have your CSA going, you have, you’re doing something for the planet. Right. There’s always something interesting going on. It’s fasting, intellectual, and science work. You’re not just like, okay, big corporation says I need to spray X nitrogen and borrow money to pay them. You know, and that’s it. Like, it’s really fascinating, exciting stuff. and, and really, you know, aside from sort of Native Americans have been doing it for a long time, sort of little communities like Amish, and then sort of environmental, like hippies, you know, the old folks mm-hmm. the people we see in the space, they’re young and they’re excited and they’re going into like places in California that are desert and implementing this stuff and Right. And, and the, the ground comes back to life, you know, even in the bible, in the Old Testament land of milk and honey. Right, right. there’s beautiful stories of, it was not all desert. Right. Libya. Mm-hmm. total desert, one of the hottest, most desert places on earth. Mm-hmm. was grasslands. Yeah. Where they were growing food and had animals. Wow. Now it’s desert. That’s, you know, it’s coming to America slowly if we don’t do something different, and what, what can we do differently? Well, we can get excited about farming, excited about agriculture, excited about animals. Exactly. and excited about our health. it all works together pretty well. And you know what? You feel better when you live consistent with your values.
Exactly. Vote with your dollar, make for sure that who you’re supporting, where you’re getting your food and produce or whatever you are purchasing, whatever you’re purchasing, that you know where it’s coming from, that you know that you can support the integrity of that company. And just really, it goes along with your values and your morals in general. So,
In the, in the latest farm Bill. You know, finally the Congress, you know, has done something good in the Farm Bill, and they put a lot, they’ve put a lot more into transitioning to organic and regenerative. Mm-hmm. We, we get all the politicians through here, so, you know, every four years they all come through, we hear all the proposals, you know. Yeah. and the idea, you know, the idea is to find, is to find proposals that are not just in the pocket of the chemical companies.
I really appreciate you coming on. This has been so amazing. We’ve learned so much. And again, like I said, like even if you feel like you know so much about it, I, I’ve read the book, cow Saved the Planet. It is very much about regenerative farming. That’s a great resource. If you, if you wanna get into the science of it, it teaches a lot about all of that. I love being able to have this type of opportunity to have a conversation with somebody, especially somebody like you from Kalona, Sam, it’s been a pleasure and it has been, we’ve had such a great conversation and have learned so much. So the way I like to end my podcast, I wanna do some rapid fire questions. Sure. okay, let, does it involve organic
eggnog, which is on shelves now.
Okay. is that, is that a new product? Because I actually wanted to circle back to that because I love eggnog. There you go. That is amazing. Better be in the South Carolina, earth Fair.
I need to tell people down there to start going to Earth Fair if you want our products in your store, go to our website and fill out the store request form. Absolutely. I’ve sort of put that all over the place because we’re really focusing on that. when it comes in, we’ll tell you, go talk to the dairy manager because they respond to customer requests. Mm-hmm. if they won’t carry it in the store for whatever reason, they can probably special order cases of it for you. So you can get cases of whipping cream, whatever, share with your friends.Josie: 54:30
Ab I, I mean, I will. I, I, yeah. And then
we work on the back. We work on the backend, just like we need policy makers to go, we need regenerative farming, here’s how we’re gonna support it from a funding perspective and legislative perspective, while we have consumers demand it, unless we get both happening, it doesn’t.
okay. So rapid fire questions. Are you ready? Yeah. what would, if you could have any superpower, what would be your superpower? Oh gosh.
Oh, you want an honest answer. Honest, I’d be a better. Oh yeah, I’d be a better dad. I’ve got four kids. one has Down Syndrome. He’s 25. Mm-hmm. we adopted our 18 year old who just sent off to college. Mm-hmm. We got a 12 year old, and then 13 years later, we adopted a, the half brother of our, first of our daughter that we adopted. So the county valley called me and said, we got another, this baby came, woman came in, she had a baby meth, drugs, homeless, drunk. Mm-hmm. had another baby. We put her name in the system and looks like you adopted her first baby 13 years ago. Do you wanna know that? Wow. And I said, I’m 45. Are you
Yeah. So I’ve stayed, I’ve gotta stay home with our kids while they’re babies, my wife’s doctor. but I wish, I wish I was just more focused on them and it, you know, do with them what my dad would do with me when we grew up on the farm. Yeah. You know, and I wanna live on a. All the time, but my wife doesn’t let me.
Oh, I, I’m the same way you know? Honestly, was that too personal? That was too, no, I, I love that. That’s one of the reasons why I started a podcast is because I enjoy having deep conversations with people. Yeah. And not so much as surface level conversations.
Easier to fuss about and talk about what’s going on in the world than it is sometimes to handle very personal, important situations in our own lives.
Absolutely. You’re, that’s a hundred percent correct. Sometimes it’s easier to, yeah. To put your focus elsewhere and not deal what’s going on internally. So yeah. I appreciate your response. That’s super. I, I am sure that you. An amazing father, but I feel like I’m not a parent yet, but I believe that probably most parents think the exact same thing. Alright. Have you taken any personality tests? Yes. Have you taken like Myers Briggs?
E n fj, I think E N F J. So explain that for a second.
extrovert, obviously intuitive, I feel things mm-hmm. ju judicious or judgemental. Is it judgemental or judicious? or, you know, you form pretty strong opinions about what’s right and wrong in the world. Right. N F J F is for feeling, I think. Mm-hmm. I would, I’m artistic. I feel things pretty deeply.
Gotcha. I’m an I N F P, so introverted, but also like, feel the things and all that too. Cool. Okay, so one meal that you could eat for the rest of your life. Every single.
Oh gosh. It’s hard to beat. Pizza just is really hard. Yeah. Pizza. Pizza. You know, the bread, the meat, the cheese all in one. Yeah. You know, beef, food, vegetables in there too, like Yeah. It’s really side of milk. Yeah. Yeah. I was a Dr. Pepper addict for years. God helped me. I’m pro, I’m a, you know, I’m a wreck. You probably can’t tell, but I’m a mess. I need, I need a 20 minute consultation. I know, I saw that on your website. Yeah. Everybody could go there, by the way, and like get some help.
Absolutely. You are Dr. Pepper fanatic, pizza lover. So, no, it’s totally fine. No judgment here because it’s not too
late. It’s not too late to change. It’s never too late. How habits to become inspired about
saving your Earth Absolutely. Never too late for either of those. I appreciate it. All right, last question. Two things you’d take with you on a deserted island if you knew you were gonna be stuck there and could take two things.
I just say cow A goat. A goat, goat. Eat everything. It wouldn’t wouldn’t last On fire maybe. I dunno, I watch those show sometimes like stranded like, yep, I could do this. And I’m, yeah, maybe not That’s so funny. Naked and afraid. I don’t think so.
I know I loves, I used to love Survivor and I hadn’t watched it in like 12 years and so I just watched a couple seasons. It was on like Paramount Plus and I watched a couple seasons. Yeah. And I’m like, I could probably do this, I could probably do this. I mean, like if I had to, I probably could, but like would I voluntarily, probably not Well, Sam, thank you so much for being on today. It has been a pleasure. We’ve learned so much. You guys, if you have not been able to get your hands on Kalona, go on their website, request it to be in one of your stores in your town or nearby town. I personally have to drive like 15 minutes to go get it into a different town, but I will drive because it’s not that far. I just listen to a podcast and I love getting my colonna. So, we appreciate all your knowledge on regenerative farming. Thank you so much for being here today and hopefully we’re able to talk soon.
Thank you. And if you need some help, if you’re frustrated about what’s going on in the world, in the environment, go look up the Savory Institute. I’ll give you some
hope. Absolutely. Perfect. And all this will be in the show notes. Awesome. Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you everybody.